XC a “TEAM” Sport
11/01/2018 5:59:25 AM
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Region 2A is a prime example that to qualify for state you must have a good “team”. In the girls race the 5 individual spots that qualified for state were in the top 7! That certainly is a disadvantage for this schools struggling to recruit runners due to other sports.
Region 2A is a prime example that to qualify for state you must have a good "team". In the girls race the 5 individual spots that qualified for state were in the top 7! That certainly is a disadvantage for this schools struggling to recruit runners due to other sports.
11/01/2018 8:58:30 AM
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@stamina_1 Huh. Just out of pure curiosity I looked at the results and can't figure out what you mean. It looked like the 15th girl took the last individual qualifier which seems about correct. How does this change recruiting from other sports? I'm not arguing. I'm just trying to figure out the statement.
@stamina_1 Huh. Just out of pure curiosity I looked at the results and can't figure out what you mean. It looked like the 15th girl took the last individual qualifier which seems about correct. How does this change recruiting from other sports? I'm not arguing. I'm just trying to figure out the statement.
11/01/2018 10:33:24 AM
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I can explain. Advancing to the State Meet from Regions are the top 3 teams plus the top 5 individuals not on the advancing top 3 teams. So the top 5 girls not on Union, Ridgeview, and Graham were finishers 1, 2, 5, 6, 7.
I can explain. Advancing to the State Meet from Regions are the top 3 teams plus the top 5 individuals not on the advancing top 3 teams. So the top 5 girls not on Union, Ridgeview, and Graham were finishers 1, 2, 5, 6, 7.
11/01/2018 10:46:28 AM
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@sidallen I did understand how they advance, but I looked at the incorrect Region. Now it makes sense.
@sidallen I did understand how they advance, but I looked at the incorrect Region. Now it makes sense.
11/01/2018 11:31:25 AM
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I have been thinking about the top five not on an advancing team rule and I really do not like it. There are two reasons: 1) It's really hard to know what you have to do before and during a race to make it. You're not sure if the kid you're behind is on an advancing team or not. 2) It is entirely possible that a kid could pass someone right at the finish and the act of passing that person could actually cause them NOT to advance. Imagine that two teams were going to tie for third and one of those teams has three real good runners (better than you) and two not so good runners. The other team has five runners that are pretty good but none are as good as you. The team with the good runners is going to advance based on a tie breaker and you end up as the #5 runner going to states. Now imagince you pass a kid from the third place team at the last second and thereby add one point to their score. Now the team that has all the runners just behind you gets the automatic bid, and the team that has the runner you passed takes two of the individual bids and thereby pushing you out. Even though you finished in a higher position in the race overall, you cost yourself a chance to go to states. I really like having a specific place you have to finish in order to advance.
I have been thinking about the top five not on an advancing team rule and I really do not like it. There are two reasons:

1) It's really hard to know what you have to do before and during a race to make it. You're not sure if the kid you're behind is on an advancing team or not.

2) It is entirely possible that a kid could pass someone right at the finish and the act of passing that person could actually cause them NOT to advance. Imagine that two teams were going to tie for third and one of those teams has three real good runners (better than you) and two not so good runners. The other team has five runners that are pretty good but none are as good as you. The team with the good runners is going to advance based on a tie breaker and you end up as the #5 runner going to states. Now imagince you pass a kid from the third place team at the last second and thereby add one point to their score. Now the team that has all the runners just behind you gets the automatic bid, and the team that has the runner you passed takes two of the individual bids and thereby pushing you out.

Even though you finished in a higher position in the race overall, you cost yourself a chance to go to states.

I really like having a specific place you have to finish in order to advance.
11/01/2018 7:20:32 PM
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Have to agree with you mattymath. Years ago (sorry, to old to remember exactly when) it used to be that top 15 in region went to state, regardless of team standing. I would be happy to see that again.
Have to agree with you mattymath. Years ago (sorry, to old to remember exactly when) it used to be that top 15 in region went to state, regardless of team standing. I would be happy to see that again.
11/01/2018 8:46:58 PM
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The same thing happened in the 6A region D girls meet. The top 5 finishers not on one of the top 3 teams finished 1, 2, 4, 5 and 6.
The same thing happened in the 6A region D girls meet. The top 5 finishers not on one of the top 3 teams finished 1, 2, 4, 5 and 6.
11/02/2018 9:18:43 AM
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@mattymath and @cawitt - I will give you the argument for why I like the top 5 on non-qualifying teams. If you are in a top heavy region, where the top 2-3 teams are state champion caliber teams, then it could be quite possible that all other teams would get shut out and there would be little to run for if you were not on one of those teams. Region 4D on the girls side typically dips into the 20s for our 5th qualify due to a couple of state champion caliber teams that routine place 5-7 girls in the top 15. I would imagine this would also be the case if there was a second powerful team in the boys region with Loudon Valley. In fact, I looked at the times and had Blacksburg moved into Region 4D in 2016 (when both EC Glass and Jefferson Forest had solid teams)instead 2017, girls who finished in the top 25 at states would not have been there because they would not have been in the top 15 finishers from Region 4D. Ideally, I think top 5 on non-qualifying teams or 15 finishers at Region meet, whichever creates more qualifiers would be best.
@mattymath and @cawitt - I will give you the argument for why I like the top 5 on non-qualifying teams. If you are in a top heavy region, where the top 2-3 teams are state champion caliber teams, then it could be quite possible that all other teams would get shut out and there would be little to run for if you were not on one of those teams. Region 4D on the girls side typically dips into the 20s for our 5th qualify due to a couple of state champion caliber teams that routine place 5-7 girls in the top 15. I would imagine this would also be the case if there was a second powerful team in the boys region with Loudon Valley. In fact, I looked at the times and had Blacksburg moved into Region 4D in 2016 (when both EC Glass and Jefferson Forest had solid teams)instead 2017, girls who finished in the top 25 at states would not have been there because they would not have been in the top 15 finishers from Region 4D. Ideally, I think top 5 on non-qualifying teams or 15 finishers at Region meet, whichever creates more qualifiers would be best.
11/02/2018 1:02:43 PM
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@Runnerhheaj Believe me, I understand that. My own daughter, when she was in high school, was victim to the "really hard district" curse. I just feel like we ought to be able to come up with a system where we get deserving kids in with out resorting to a game-theory disaster (sorry, Stats teacher) method where kids can cost themselves a spot in states by running faster.
@Runnerhheaj

Believe me, I understand that. My own daughter, when she was in high school, was victim to the "really hard district" curse.

I just feel like we ought to be able to come up with a system where we get deserving kids in with out resorting to a game-theory disaster (sorry, Stats teacher) method where kids can cost themselves a spot in states by running faster.
11/02/2018 1:03:39 PM
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@mattymath I definitely feel like any all-Region kids (top 15) should go to states.
@mattymath

I definitely feel like any all-Region kids (top 15) should go to states.

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