Lower starting height for Pole Vault at Decathlon. What say you?
05/17/2016 10:58:42 PM
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I first would like to thank Coach Devon Hind for hosting this event. I would like to see the ASHAA track committee lower the standards for the pole vault to 7ft. Why? You only have to qualify in 6 of 10 events for the decathlon. We still score the athletes that do not meet the minimum marks in the other running or throwing events. Why are we penalizing the athletes that cannot jump 8'6"? There were 24 discuss throwers that did not throw the minimum of 78'9"; 21 Javelin throws under 109'11" The #6 finisher threw 104'11"; 14 hurdlers ran slower than 19.99; 6 people finished slower that 5:59 in the 1500. Those whom did not meet the minimums still scored in the events. I would like to see the minimum lowered to 7feet. I think this would be fair to the 18 jumpers that did not clear the opening height. 2 of the top 20 finishers had a No Height. What do you think?
I first would like to thank Coach Devon Hind for hosting this event.

I would like to see the ASHAA track committee lower the standards for the pole vault to 7ft. Why? You only have to qualify in 6 of 10 events for the decathlon. We still score the athletes that do not meet the minimum marks in the other running or throwing events. Why are we penalizing the athletes that cannot jump 8'6"? There were 24 discuss throwers that did not throw the minimum of 78'9"; 21 Javelin throws under 109'11" The #6 finisher threw 104'11"; 14 hurdlers ran slower than 19.99; 6 people finished slower that 5:59 in the 1500. Those whom did not meet the minimums still scored in the events. I would like to see the minimum lowered to 7feet. I think this would be fair to the 18 jumpers that did not clear the opening height. 2 of the top 20 finishers had a No Height. What do you think?
05/18/2016 1:18:08 PM
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We had a low minimum 6-6 or 7ft up until a few years aback and it was an absolute spectacle. I believe at that point the AHSAA stepped in and asked for some guidelines for competition be set. The reason the guidelines were set at what they are is the minimum qualifiers were all around the same amount of points. The argument that xyz competed and was below minimum yet still scored points isnt much difference than a 4x800 qualifying at sectionals then running slower than the qualifying mark.
We had a low minimum 6-6 or 7ft up until a few years aback and it was an absolute spectacle. I believe at that point the AHSAA stepped in and asked for some guidelines for competition be set.
The reason the guidelines were set at what they are is the minimum qualifiers were all around the same amount of points.
The argument that xyz competed and was below minimum yet still scored points isnt much difference than a 4x800 qualifying at sectionals then running slower than the qualifying mark.
05/18/2016 4:24:55 PM
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I agree with the original poster. While I understand the "spectacle" of inexperienced athletes vaulting at any height, the bottom line is that, in the multi-events, the scoring system is designed to give points for very low marks. And, like the original poster said, many got those points for very low marks in the other events. The same situation happened in girls high jump, with 9 athletes not passing opening height and paying a big price for it, as opening height alone garnered 379 points (and was, by the way, above the qualifying mark by about 1 inch, which seems a bit strange). While we are on the topic, there were multiple athletes, at least on the girls side, that, based on the milesplit database, had not met the qualifying standards. Some of them did very well and certainly deserved to be there, but many teams/athletes sacrificed during the year by putting athletes in less than ideal events or into extra meets in order to meet these standards only to find that they weren't enforced. I know the qualifying process is now only two years old, but, in my opinion, it should either be enforced or scrapped; its really not fair to the teams/athletes that follow the rules. Finally, it was clearly stated in the spring sports book that girls high jump would start at 1.29m and advance by 3 cm, but it was started at 1.27m and advanced by 5 cm. Once again, I have no problem with that method, but shouldn't we follow what's stated in the rules? I think that the decathlon/heptathlon is a great event, and I thoroughly enjoyed watching it (kudos to Coach Hind), but I think we need to review the starting heights, enforcement of qualifying standards, and bar progressions.
I agree with the original poster. While I understand the "spectacle" of inexperienced athletes vaulting at any height, the bottom line is that, in the multi-events, the scoring system is designed to give points for very low marks. And, like the original poster said, many got those points for very low marks in the other events. The same situation happened in girls high jump, with 9 athletes not passing opening height and paying a big price for it, as opening height alone garnered 379 points (and was, by the way, above the qualifying mark by about 1 inch, which seems a bit strange).

While we are on the topic, there were multiple athletes, at least on the girls side, that, based on the milesplit database, had not met the qualifying standards. Some of them did very well and certainly deserved to be there, but many teams/athletes sacrificed during the year by putting athletes in less than ideal events or into extra meets in order to meet these standards only to find that they weren't enforced. I know the qualifying process is now only two years old, but, in my opinion, it should either be enforced or scrapped; its really not fair to the teams/athletes that follow the rules.

Finally, it was clearly stated in the spring sports book that girls high jump would start at 1.29m and advance by 3 cm, but it was started at 1.27m and advanced by 5 cm. Once again, I have no problem with that method, but shouldn't we follow what's stated in the rules?

I think that the decathlon/heptathlon is a great event, and I thoroughly enjoyed watching it (kudos to Coach Hind), but I think we need to review the starting heights, enforcement of qualifying standards, and bar progressions.
05/18/2016 8:58:17 PM
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Not saying they did / or did not qualify from the previous year, but dont forget they could use a previous year mark.
Not saying they did / or did not qualify from the previous year, but dont forget they could use a previous year mark.
05/18/2016 10:24:06 PM
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I included last year's marks, too. Again, on the surface, it's not that big of a deal; I just don't know why we have rules if we are going to ignore them. Not exactly the best message to send to our kids...
I included last year's marks, too. Again, on the surface, it's not that big of a deal; I just don't know why we have rules if we are going to ignore them. Not exactly the best message to send to our kids...
05/19/2016 10:33:46 PM
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One thing that should be looked at as how long it took for the high pit for pole vault to finish while half the field had to wait so long for them to finish. I know Coach Bentley work hard to get that pit finished quickly. This is one reason why it takes so long for the decathlon to finish. I believe we could remedy this by putting the starting height for pole vault at a lower height like 7 feet and have successive heights moved up by 20 or 25 cm. We should have high jump move up 5 to 8 cm per successive height. The decathlon and heptathlon are great for our sport. Two seasons ago we discovered a new event for an female athlete that can now throw the javelin 151 feet. I believe our qualifiers are great. We should allow all athlete an opportunity to score in high and pole vault that also allows the events to move more quickly. All athletes get three throws/jumps. We should improve high/vault so all can score but make these events move more quickly by adjusting the next bar height.
One thing that should be looked at as how long it took for the high pit for pole vault to finish while half the field had to wait so long for them to finish. I know Coach Bentley work hard to get that pit finished quickly. This is one reason why it takes so long for the decathlon to finish. I believe we could remedy this by putting the starting height for pole vault at a lower height like 7 feet and have successive heights moved up by 20 or 25 cm. We should have high jump move up 5 to 8 cm per successive height.

The decathlon and heptathlon are great for our sport. Two seasons ago we discovered a new event for an female athlete that can now throw the javelin 151 feet.

I believe our qualifiers are great. We should allow all athlete an opportunity to score in high and pole vault that also allows the events to move more quickly. All athletes get three throws/jumps. We should improve high/vault so all can score but make these events move more quickly by adjusting the next bar height.
05/23/2016 12:13:41 PM
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Starting heights were set 2 years ago when we almost lost the event. AHSAA officials were appalled when they witnessed the competition in 2014 and demanded that the event be a haven for quality athletes and not an end of the year party. Lowering the starting heights is not an option if we want to keep the event. I don't know why the starting height in the girls HJ was not adhered to. That will be a point of emphasis next year. Also--there is no check system in place to monitor whether everyone has qualified in their 4 or 6 events. if you have a suggestion for how to do that you can email me at dhind@hoover.k12.al.us. Thanks for all the input and thoughts. Healthy discussions and valid points.
Starting heights were set 2 years ago when we almost lost the event. AHSAA officials were appalled when they witnessed the competition in 2014 and demanded that the event be a haven for quality athletes and not an end of the year party. Lowering the starting heights is not an option if we want to keep the event. I don't know why the starting height in the girls HJ was not adhered to. That will be a point of emphasis next year.

Also--there is no check system in place to monitor whether everyone has qualified in their 4 or 6 events. if you have a suggestion for how to do that you can email me at dhind@hoover.k12.al.us.

Thanks for all the input and thoughts. Healthy discussions and valid points.

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